Re: Horizon 202

[Rod Sage <rsage@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Hello Glenn,
I don't plan to jump in any farther until I am fairly sure there should be a
spring. The shutter dial seams to adjust how far the slit can open, but doesn't
hold it there. It can open and close up to that point. If for example the
shutter is set at 1/125 and the drum is at half swing, the slit will easy slop
back and forth  from full closed to half closed.

Glenn Barry wrote:

> Hi Rod,
>
> You may be on the right track here, and you may not, don't confuse the slit
> width and the shutter. For memory there is no spring mechanism associated
> with the slit as it is controlled by the shutter speed setting dial. It
> should move freely. I don't know if you got the diagram that I sent, the
> formatting may have gone haywire in the transmission, it sure came back
> looking scrambled.
> I would hold off taking the drum out, as I am pretty sure that most, if not
> all of the springs and associated mechanisms for the shutter are on the
> outside of that part of the camera.
> Sorry that I can't be of more assistance, but I don't have the camera to
> look at anymore.
>
> Glenn
>
> Rod Sage wrote:
>
> > Glenn,
> > I thought I would update you. The catch mechanism seems to be working
> > correctly. I have a feeling that the flat pin which sticks out of the
> > drum and controls the slit needs to have a spring which pushes it toward
> > the open position. After the shutter trips it is pushed shut at the far
> > end. When the shutter is wound on and released it is opened to the width
> > of the setting. That pin just slops back and forth. I have removed the
> > top casting, but need a puller to get the bearing off so that I can go
> > lower into the drum. I am considering opening up my other Horizon to
> > confirm that the pin needs a spring. When looking into the drum I can
> > almost see a small hole on the flat pin which looks like a wire would
> > fit through it. I'll keep you posted.
> > Rod
> >
> > > Hi Rod,
> > >
> > > the culprit that you are looking for is on the top of the right side
> > > of the drum under a "layer"  as you look at the camera from behind.
> > > For memory there will be a small brass or copper latch mechanism which
> > > moves the shutter, don't confuse this with the slit selection
> > > mechanism. It doesn't have any levers attached to it at all. It works
> > > this way, you take the picture and the drum rotates a little forther
> > > that the shutter latch and it clicks closed, when you wind on at the
> > > end of the stroke it goes over what can best be described as a bump
> > > and clicks open again, that is why it is always recommended to hit the
> > > rewind button and complete the wind on stroke, just in case it gets a
> > > bump and clicks open. If it does that is what fogs the roll during
> > > rewind.
> > >
> > >
> > > I will type a mock of thee camera and try to indicate the region where
> > > you should be looking. Bear in mind that I am doing this for memory,
> > > as I haven't lookad at one of these for over a year and it was at
> > > least that twice long ago that I had to repair it.
> > >
> > > This is a top view:
> > >
> > >                                                           Z   Z   Z
> > >
> > > Z                     Z   X
> > >
> > > Z                             Z
> > >                          __________ Z
> > > Z__________
> > >
> > > I
> > > I
> > >
> > > I
> > > I
> > >
> > > I
> > > I
> > >                          I ______________________________________I
> > >
> > > The catch to look for will be in this position when the camera is
> > > wound on. Look for it under the metal plate on the top of the drum.
> > > You don't need to take anything more off of the camera, probably just
> > > bend a a few things fractionally to adjust them so that the shutter
> > > latch pops open again once it has jumped over a small copper thing.
> > > Sorry about the quality of my descriptions, but once you see the bits
> > > I am talking about, you will understand my difficulty in describing
> > > them.
> > >
> > > Let me know how you go
> > >
> > > Glenn
> > >
> > >
> > > Rod Sage wrote:
> > >
> > >> Glen,
> > >> Anyhow, I have the cover off and have discovered the problem. There
> > >> is a flat pin
> > >> which sticks out of the top of the drum which when moved back and
> > >> forth, opens and
> > >> closes the variable slit. The pin wants to stay in the closed
> > >> position. When the
> > >> brass latch is moved out of the way the pin moves back and forth
> > >> easily (maybe too
> > >> easily). I see how the slit is closed after the exposure, and I
> > >> think that something
> > >> needs to push on the pin to open it when the shutter is cocked.
> > >> There are 2 black
> > >> levers which comes off the shutter button and I think that one of
> > >> those must open the
> > >> slit, but the lever is about 2mm above the pin. If I bend that pin
> > >> down it may open
> > >> the slit, but looks like it would also close it as soon as the drum
> > >> rotates back.
> > >> Then there is that brass latch. Should that latch ride over the
> > >> adjustable pin
> > >> towards the front of the camera or should it push around that pin to
> > >> allow the flat
> > >> slit pin to move to the open position? I hope I am making some
> > >> sense. Any ideas?
> > >> Thanks,
> > >> Rod
> > >>
> > >> Glenn Barry wrote:
> > >>
> > >> > Hi Rod,
> > >> >
> > >> > Mine also went part way towards what would have been a 500
> > >> setting, this is from
> > >> > my internal investigations, normal.
> > >> >
> > >> > You only have to remove the covers, the rest should be pretty much
> > >> self evident
> > >> > once you see how the trip mechanism works.
> > >> >
> > >> > It is really easy and nothing to procastinate about, I'm speaking
> > >> from experience
> > >> > on that one.
> > >> >
> > >> > Glenn
> > >> >
> > >> > Rod Sage wrote:
> > >> >
> > >> > > > Rod,
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > > Before my horizon was stolen, wish that came under warranty, I
> > >> had to do
> > >> > > > surgery on it a few times. Once for the problem you describe.
> > >> It is a fairly
> > >> > > > easy camera to work on as the mechanism that you have to
> > >> access is just
> > >> > > > under the plastic cover, that comes off realtively easily.
> > >> Once you have
> > >> > > > that off the mechanisms themselves are pretty much self
> > >> exlpanatory. You can
> > >> > > > do the work with a set of small screwdrivers, one phillips and
> > >> one small
> > >> > > > slotted to be minimalist.
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > > If you are game to have a go at it, let me know and I can give
> > >> you some
> > >> > > > pointers from memory. The fault that you describe is the
> > >> adjustment is the
> > >> > > > re-alignment of the latch mechanism which takes some simple
> > >> observation and
> > >> > > > a couple of minutes to correct.
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > > Glenn
> > >> > > >
> > >> > >   Glen,
> > >> > > Thanks for the reply. I'm willing to have a go at it. I'll
> > >> probably sit
> > >> > > down and tackle it in a few days. That first step is always the
> > >> hardest.
> > >> > > One thing I have noticed is that the shutter setting swings
> > >> beyond the
> > >> > > numbers. Do you think I may have disturbed something? I may
> > >> contact you
> > >> > > again after I open it up.
> > >> > > Thanks,
> > >> > > Rod
> > >> >
> > >> > --
> > >> > Glenn Barry Photography
> > >> > 2/13 Gerroa Avenue
> > >> > Bayview
> > >> > N.S.W. 2104
> > >> > Australia
> > >> > Ph (612) 9211 3080
> > >> > Mobile 0415 279 366
> > >> > E-Mail: mailto:glenn@xxxxxxxxxxx
> > >> > Web: http://www.acay.com.au/~glenn
> > >
> > > --
> > > Glenn Barry Photography
> > > 2/13 Gerroa Avenue
> > > Bayview
> > > N.S.W. 2104
> > > Australia
> > > Ph (612) 9211 3080
> > > Mobile 0415 279 366
> > > E-Mail: mailto:glenn@xxxxxxxxxxx
> > > Web: http://www.acay.com.au/~glenn
> > >
>
> --
> Glenn Barry Photography
> 2/13 Gerroa Avenue
> Bayview
> N.S.W. 2104
> Australia
> Ph (612) 9211 3080
> Mobile 0415 279 366
> E-Mail: mailto:glenn@xxxxxxxxxxx
> Web: http://www.acay.com.au/~glenn