7-Perf Bias?

[Derek Gee <73157.2172@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Dr. T writes:
>Unfortunately, when I joined the Detroit Stereo Club
> discovered a bias by the judges for the wider formats.  So, I ended up
>using a wider (7-p) for most of my slides just to increase their chances of
>success, even though in some cases I felt that the 5-p mount was more suited
>for the picture.  Some full-frame twin SLR slides I had to remount from 5-p
>to 7-p mounts and, get this, some Realist slides I had to enlarge and mount
>in 7-p mounts!  That's sad...and I think that the inexperience of some
>judges is to blame in certain cases.  An experienced judge should not be
>affected by the sheer size of the image and should actually substract
>points if there is a lot of uwanted/uncropped space.  But seeing a picture
>of the top of a lighthouse at the center of empty sky getting a high score
>just because it fills the screen with (unwanted IMO) sky, does not give the
>right message to me.

A bias for wider slides?  This is news to me.  I have entered many 7-perf
slides taken mostly with my FED and have not noticed this bias.  I can
think of three seperate slides I have entered, two that were average shots
taken in difficult mixed lighting, and one above average shot.  All three
ended up with average or below average scores, so I don't think the fact
that they were 7-perf helped any.  I ended up winning a 3rd place in
the one competition where the above-average slide was entered, but it
was with a 5-perf slide taken with my Revere!  Granted, the 5-perf
slide was much better, but I was disappointed the the other slide
did not score higher than it did.

Did your 5-P slides do better in competition simply because they were
enlarged to 7-P, or was it because they were cropped effectively when
enlarged?  I would suggest the latter was the case.

I would have to agree that sometimes we have a few judges that are
experienced, but many times where my opinion has differed from the
judges, I have found the panel to contain all experienced members.
When selecting judges, we try to get a balance of experienced and
non-experienced judges.  This is a difficult task however, since
often the only folks without slides entered are the newbies.  We
do use a fourth judge, when not enough people without slides entered
can be found to judge.  The fourth judge's score is used when one of
the primary judges signals that the slide on screen is theirs by
scoring a zero.

We periodically book a program on how to judge slides, and we have
a handout available at most meetings on the side table which explains
how to judge a slide.  The officers also discuss when to refresh
the membership's memories on how to judge.  This year, we decided to
put an article about judging in the October 1995 issue of  The Stereo
Window.  If you feel there is a problem, please let the officers know and
we will bring it up for discussion again.

>Looking at the statistics, I am not very happy to see that twin SLR slides
>have higher changes of success.

I have noticed a tendancy for twin SLR slides to do well.  This appears to be
due to:

- The sharpness of the images.  (Modern lenses, accurate exposure, often times
  shot on a tripod.)

- Slight hyperstereo effect of many twin SLR shots is pleasing to many.

- Extra effort devoted to creating and setting up the photograph.  I always
  like to see the slides when we do a tabletop topic because it forces people
  to get creative and it allows people to use their SLR's if they desire.

>This happens for a number of reasons.
>There are good reasons and bad reasons.  The bad reason is judges being
>impressed by something unusual, something that they don't see too often.
>Again, from my experience in Detroit I feel that judges tend to underrate
>some good Realist slides and tend to overrate some average twin SLR slides
>based on reasons other than good stereo photography.

What's bad about judges being impressed by unusual?  That's what helps to
set apart the photographers from the snapshooters.  I also can't recall any
images that I have seen lately that I thought were overrated simply due to
them being shot with twin SLR's.  If you recall any George, please refresh my
memory. (send them private E-mail to protect the parties involved)  If you
still feel there is a bias, please talk to the officers at the next meeting
or send me E-mail and we'll try to resolve any problems and consider any 
suggestions.  Thanks!

                                  Derek Gee
                                  Vice-President
                                  Detroit Stereographic Society


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