XTOL problem... SOLVED.

["David M. Young" <david@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

 >> Is anyone using XTOL for HIE in a JOBO???  I decided to run a film test
 >> yesterday, exposed my HIE as I do normally (I normally process in D76 at
 >> 1:1 for 11 minutes at 20C with a 5 minute pre-soak), processed in XTOL as
 >> recommended (1:1 dilution 8 3/4 minutes at 20C with a 5 minute pre-soak)
 >> all in my Jobo.  The film processed in XTOL is virtually clear and
 >> completely unusable.

Thanks to George, Dan Don and Eric...  Interesting Results, and mixed!:

 From George:
 >Xtol is my developer of choice with film shot faster than EI 100, and it
 >works very nicely with HIE.
 >I would test your Xtol to see if it is good, as I can't think of a reason
 >for your results

The XTOL is fine... I mixed it the day before and used it to develop some 
PanF (which was thin... but usable)...  read on...

 From Don:
 >Do you have any frame numbers visible?

Nope... but then again it's bulk-loaded Aerographic 2424 (basically 70mm 
HIE), so that's no surprise as there aren't any.

 From Eric:
 >I use Xtol for everything EXCEPT Kodak 35mm HIE - it have never worked for
 >me. I have done tests, and never get good results -always too thin.

and from Dan:
 >I've had this happen to me on several occasions with tmax 100 and delta
 >3200 films developed in XTOL.  I think there is some sort of problem with
 >XTOL; I've heard of this happening to others on usenet as well.  I'm not
 >sure if the problem lies with the quality of the water used to mix the
 >developer (I don't use distilled water), or if there is a quality control
 >problem with xtol itself.  All I know is that I've been developing film for
 >30 years, and I've never had this sort of problem except with XTOL.  But
 >sometimes it works just fine.  Go figure.

Well... based on my research on the Kodak and Jobo sites, as well as 
archives from the infrared list and the rec.photo.darkroom newsgroup, I 
believe I've figured it out, and it might just account for the problems 
other people see as well!

Combination of  developer exhaustion and bad technique.  To begin, the 
times for rotary processing for XTOL are for use with no pre-soak, so I'll 
eliminate that in the next test.

Secondly and far more important, XTOL apparently requires enough base 
solution to handle the amount of film, and the guideline is 200ml of 
solution per 80 square inches of film (about 1 roll of 35mmx36 exposure, or 
1 roll of 120).  You can increase development time by 15% up to 200ml/160 
sq. inches, and 15% over that time will take you to 200ml/240 sq. in.

Well, my 70mm film is cut to 60 inches, giving me about 165 square 
inches... and I processed in my Jobo tank with 270ml diluted at 1:1, giving 
me a bit more than 1/4th the amount of solution I should have had for the 
time/dilution I used, and resulting in severely underdeveloped negatives.

I'm pretty well convinced based on what I've read that this is the problem 
to which most failures can be attributed... it's the one thing that seems 
to fit all the failure descriptions... but it seems no one has made the 
correlation (unless I missed it).  For those of you who had failures, how 
much stock solution to how much film did you use????

Tomorrow night, I'll be souping an identically exposed roll (I shot 5 test 
rolls of a test pattern, using exactly the same lighting, exposure, focus, 
filtration, etc and have 3 left).  I'm using the base time of 5.75 minutes 
(undiluted, continuous agitation), adjusted 15% up to 6 minutes, 35 seconds 
to handle the 165 sq. in. of film for the 270ml of solution.   I'll let the 
list know what happens and what the results look like.   If it's better 
than D76, I'll keep it.... if not, well, I've blown a couple of rolls of film.

The last test roll is reserved for a soup of ABC+ Pyro, but I plan on doing 
a fair bit of reading between now and then ;-)

Thanks again, and cheers!
D.


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David M. Young  |  david@xxxxxxxxxxxxx  |  http://www.cloudance.com
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