get real "pro" (PAUL) - formerly - RE: Images Needed! Be publishe d!

["Lee, Martin (Ex AS01)" <MLee@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

This list's standard is slipping.

Dear Pro. photographers (who are pissed off at amateurs, not all of you I
expect/hope!),
	You chose your profession knowing full well that there are many
people out there who do  photography simply for the enjoyment they get. If
they choose to sell or give away their photos - it is their choice - if it
causes you grief - it is your own fault.
You may advise us of fair prices we could charge for photos but it's not
really fair to ask us not to give away photos (or sell at well under pro.
cost).
If you want to get your photos published - photograph things that amateurs
do not - come up with images that will get you the business you want.
You have to keep ahead of the amateurs - you can't ask them to politely
stand back while the "professional" gets what he/she (you) wants.

If you want to be published in a book full of amateur photos donated or
purchased cheep then you have to expect to be paid(or not) similar summs as
your competitors (amateur or not). If this is really a quality publication
you are talking about - they are likly to be willing to pay more for the
crem-de'-crem (hopefully for you mostly professionalally taken) photos.

I agree however that nothing should be given away for free - costs incured
by the photographer should be reimbursed at least a little especially if the
rest of the production of the book is being paid for.....why should the
producers of the content of the book work for free and everyone else get
paid? - If there were no content - there would be no book, and no book = no
$ for anyone!

that's all. I'll shut up now!



-----Original Message-----
From: grays@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:grays@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]
Sent: Friday, January 22, 1999 1:57 PM
To: panorama-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: Images Needed! Be published!


dear paul-not knowing you personally all I can say is thank god for that.
you
might be [pissed off at amateurs]-well this AMATEUR is sick of your
attitude. If
this is the kind of CRAP I have to read from you then I am sure there are a
whole bunch of PISSED OFF AT PROFESSIONALS WITH STICKS SHOVED UP THEIR BUTTS
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
yours sincerely,
CHIP RENNER
Paul Aparycki wrote:

> >Joel,
> >I agree there should be compensation for the Photographer.
> >Through all the years I have been  Pro Photographer, I have always
believed
> >that if you give your work away, you have established it's value.
> >Sam
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: Joel Seaman <jseaman@xxxxxxxxxxx>
> >To: panorama-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <panorama-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >Date: Tuesday, January 19, 1999 10:41 AM
> >Subject: Re: Images Needed! Be published!
> >
> >
> >I have a thought/suggestion about the request for free images.  No fee
> >is offered, and therefore the publisher is suggesting that free exposure
> >alone is of value.  The publisher should include an appendix  in which
> >each photographer is alotted a small paragraph for bio, contact info,
> >type of work offered, etc.  This request would then offer a more
> >reasonable value in exchange for the free photos.
> >
> >Joel Seaman
>
> To carry the thought further, and lets' be fair about this, if the photog
> should donate his work, I think it only fair that the editor should work
> for free(!) oooh! a four letter word!, and why not the publisher? give
away
> the book for free? (there's that damn four letter word again), after all
it
> is good exposure, no?, why not the printer? the bookstore? the binder? and
> everybody else? GET REAL ASSHOLE . . . it costs any REAL photographer TIME
> and MONEY to produce a photograph. Those of us who ARE professional
> photographers, do this for a living . . . it is a business (and a
passion),
> but neither I, nor anyone else, can keep up quality work if we give it
away
> for free in desperation just to get published.
>
> pissed off by amateurs,
>
> yours
>
> Paul Aparycki